INTERVIEW: Mykhailo Horyn speaks on future role of UWCC
by Roman Woronowycz
Kyiv Press Bureau
The following is an edited interview with Mykhailo Horyn, who was elected president of the Ukrainian World Coordinating Council (UWCC) on May 20 in Kyiv. He succeeded Ivan Drach, who was UWCC president in the first eight years of its existence, during which time the organization was often criticized for its lack of effectiveness.
Mr. Horyn, a former political prisoner and a founder of Rukh - the Popular Movement for Perebudova in 1989, has been a national deputy in Ukraine's Verkhovna Rada and the leader of the Ukrainian Republican Party.
The interview was conducted on June 26 at the office of The Ukrainian Weekly's Kyiv Bureau.
PART I
Q: Do you think the work of the UWCC has been satisfactory to date? How would you grade its work?
A: This is a rhetorical question, in other words it needs no answer. Of course, I absolutely believe that work of the UWCC to date is not only weak, but completely unsatisfactory. The situation has been caused by a whole series of circumstances. It is not only the indifferent attitude of community and political activists and leaders to the problems associated with maintaining a dialogue with the diaspora, it is also caused by the economic situation in Ukraine, which makes it difficult to aportion something for cooperation with the diaspora.
I am not saying that this is the only reason. Another reason that there is no funding for work with the diaspora is because government structures have failed to give the appropriate attention to cooperation with the diaspora.
The UWCC lives on the membership dues of communities that are part of the UWCC. But if we don't find real means to develop activities so that the leadership of the UWCC can maintain contacts with the large communities of, let's say, Central Asia, Siberia and Russia - not just the West - then we will be coordinating things of which we know nothing.
I hope that somehow we can find the funds that will give us the possibility to help Ukrainian communities abroad and to finance contacts with those communities. In this respect [our job] is a search for financing. Our communities do finance us to a certain extent, the Ukrainian American Coordinating Council, the Ukrainian World Congress (UWC) give some money for the work of the UWCC, but this is only a few thousand dollars. I underscore: a few thousand dollars.
The membership dues do not give us the ability to widely expand the work of stimulating and coordinating the work of Ukrainian communities abroad, and especially on the territory of the Russian Federation.
Q: One of the criticisms of the UWCC is that it has no real accomplishments to date, that it simply exists. Could you please comment on such assertions?
A: An interesting question, but the words "simply exists" are a bit radical. It is difficult for the UWCC to work effectively without financial resources. We have had a whole series of programs, recently an academic conference was held. I recently became acquainted with the large Ukrainian community in Bendery in the Transdniester region during a visit there, where I took part in a conference they sponsored.
This is to say that programs continue, but it all depends on concrete financing. Representatives of the UWC, Askold Lozynskyj, Viktor Pedenko, Maria Shkambara, recently had the opportunity to visit a large number of Ukrainian communities on the territory of Russia, in Kazakstan, and the Baltics states of Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia. This was done because they have the financial resources. Without a doubt the UWC works effectively in the sense that it gives these communities financial support, grants of money - hundreds, perhaps thousands of dollars apiece - so that they can purchase what they need. This is beneficial aid, and the visits themselves help to strengthen ties.
To say that the UWCC simply exists does not reflect reality, but to say that it is not as effective as it should be, that is true, inasmuch as this is closely tied to a lack of financing.
Q: Another criticism often heard is that the organization is not transparent, that its organizational inner workings are not clear.
A: To that I can only say that I came to this organization only on May 20. I have been working for about a month, and am working on a specific plan for the development of our future work.
I believe that each community organization that exists must report on its financial situation and its work. I saw the reports that the head of the Secretariat had submitted in the past and agree that they do not meet Western expectations.
If you purchased a computer, then submit a receipt of purchase. If you purchased a pen, submit a receipt of purchase. These details were not apparent during the last general meeting of the UWCC, but I assure you that such detailed reports will given in the future in a systematic manner. In the past only general reports were given - how much money was spent on what programs. But I don't think this issue is so critical as to be considered characteristic of how the UWCC works.
Q: Do you think the relations between the two world Ukrainian organizations - the UWCC and the UWC - have developed and continue to develop in a normal fashion?
A: The question of relations between the UWCC and the UWC has been an issue for a while now and is a result of growth and the need to delineate authority. I don't think that the UWC and the UWCC are organizations equal in stature. The UWC is part of the UWCC, an integral part of it.
Today there are various interpretations of this position. At the last convention of the UWCC, the president of the Ukrainian World Congress, Askold Lozynskyj, made a presentation during which he announced that the UWC represents 20 million Ukrainians that live outside the borders of Ukraine. If you believe this line of thought, then it turns out that the UWC represents the Ukrainian world community that lives outside the borders of Ukraine and the UWCC represents the Ukrainians that live within the borders of Ukraine.
The whole idea behind the UWCC then changes and the name itself - the Ukrainian World Coordinating Council - becomes inaccurate. The word "world" should then be dropped and it should read the Ukrainian Coordinating Council.
If we, in fact, coordinate, then we coordinate the activities of the world community of Ukrainians. I believe that in this situation - and this will happen - we need to define the responsibilities of these two very strong organizations.
There is no doubt that today the UWC does important work. But can the UWC today do the work that is needed to ensure the continued existence of the diaspora? Can the UWC organize higher education for the youth of the diaspora in the universities of Ukraine? Can the UWC organize teachers from Ukraine for Ukrainian schools in the diaspora?
This is simply on the educational level, I will not even mention contacts in the scientific field and others. It is possible to organize international youth conferences, all-Ukrainian athletic competitions and the like for the consolidation of the youth of the Ukrainian world community. There are many things that the UWC cannot do, which only the UWCC can accomplish.
The friction that occurred during the [UWCC] convention on May 19-20 of this year, I would call friction associated with growth. If the UWCC develops dynamically today, tomorrow these problems will resolve themselves. Currently we are continuing to work, and the fact that we are working should convince our Ukrainians that the organizations exist, and that the division of responsibilities will occur in the future.
As to UWC's authority, that they represent 20 million Ukrainians abroad, they are working to realize this. In the places they visited many organizations applied to become members of the UWC. The UWC no longer represents simply the United States, Canada and Europe, it will now represent organizations that have joined only recently.
A process of expansion is occurring in the UWC, but I believe that the UWCC must parallel this approach because the UWCC can do all that the UWC can do, but the UWC cannot do all that the UWCC can. These involve issues of education, science, youth and sports.
Call it what you will, perhaps a misunderstanding; nonetheless, debates are continuing within the organizations of the Ukrainian world community. The problem will be resolved soon.
Q: But then, should two world organizations even exist?
A: I believe that two, equally large, world organizations will not stimulate the work of the world community of Ukrainians. This is a particular stage in the structuring of the Ukrainian world community. There is no alternative to a pyramidal format in the rebuilding of the world community of Ukrainians.
I believe that this is a question for tomorrow - but only if the UWCC remains a coordinating and not a command body. This demands a culture of democracy and respect from each member of our organization: the UWCC as a coordinating and not a command center, to which belong all the representatives of Ukrainian communities, whether within or outside Ukrainian territory.
This is how I see the UWCC tomorrow. Today it is a process of the growth and re-structuring of the world community of Ukrainians.
Q: You and representatives of the UWC recently met with Prime Minister Viktor Yuschenko and Vice Prime Minister Mykola Zhulynskyi. Were the meetings a success?
A: Yes, I believe so. Mr. Yuschenko proposed that the UWC and the UWCC prepare a memorandum of our understanding on how relations with the government should proceed. The UWC has not yet submitted its proposals. These will be proposals on relations between the Ukrainian government and the world community of Ukrainians.
Q: How do you expect the document to look?
A: It will depend on what we propose.
Q: And what might that be?
A: It must be a joint UWCC/UWC document on the various forms and methods of contacts between the various coordinating centers of the world Ukrainian community with the government.
Q: Is the preparatory work for the document proceeding within a joint UWCC/UWC committee or separately?
A: The Secretariat of the UWC, specifically Mr. Pedenko, is putting together the initial draft. After we receive its proposals, we will review them and return our comments and additions for approbation.
CONCLUSION
Copyright © The Ukrainian Weekly, July 16, 2000, No. 29, Vol. LXVIII
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